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Player Cameron Reddish

I'm glad he's on this team. This is my final straw with a Coach K coached defense. If he can't produce a good one with the pieces in place to have a good defensive team, then we probably won't ever have one again with him coaching.
If you want a great defensive team then you may as well get off the OAD bandwagon. Teaching 18 year olds how to playdefense is difficult especially when they have one foot out the door. Kids are either going to already be great at defense or they aren't going to be at Duke most likely.

Calipari's defensive ranks since arriving at UK:

6
17
8
90 (Noel injury)
32
1
39
7

The one other data point we have suggests it is possible.
 
I would say that Cal recruits and designs his roster more toward defense than K does. Can you imagine K having played the kind of size Cal did in 2015?
 
Rome, I've watched both games (then decided to watch Bagley's entire game against Hale, and noticed he had a few late game possessions that disgusted me more than anything I witnessed from Cam in both games)

Moreover, a sample size of a few games didn't change my opinion - which is more influenced by his complete statistical profile, elite physical tools, his natural ability to navigate PnR and his performances against high level competition.
It's not like I'm basing it entirely on game footage either. I'm also going by what multiple scouts have said. I assume they've watched more games than you and I combined.

Also, I'm not saying he doesn't have "elite physical tools" or "natural ability to navigate PnR." I'm saying that he lacks the basic assertiveness you'd expect from a top 5 player. That isn't an uncorrectable flaw, of course.
 
I'm glad he's on this team. This is my final straw with a Coach K coached defense. If he can't produce a good one with the pieces in place to have a good defensive team, then we probably won't ever have one again with him coaching.
If you want a great defensive team then you may as well get off the OAD bandwagon. Teaching 18 year olds how to playdefense is difficult especially when they have one foot out the door. Kids are either going to already be great at defense or they aren't going to be at Duke most likely.

That's an excuse. Not only have we seen Kentucky produce multiple very good to elite defenses with young teams, but Duke and Coach K showed, although only for 6 games in 2015, that it is possible. Our 2015 NCAA tournament defense was elite elite elite. It can be done, just because they're 18 doesn't make them incapable of learning a complex defensive scheme.
 
I'm glad he's on this team. This is my final straw with a Coach K coached defense. If he can't produce a good one with the pieces in place to have a good defensive team, then we probably won't ever have one again with him coaching.
If you want a great defensive team then you may as well get off the OAD bandwagon. Teaching 18 year olds how to playdefense is difficult especially when they have one foot out the door. Kids are either going to already be great at defense or they aren't going to be at Duke most likely.

That's an excuse. Not only have we seen Kentucky produce multiple very good to elite defenses with young teams, but Duke and Coach K showed, although only for 6 games in 2015, that it is possible. Our 2015 NCAA tournament defense was elite elite elite. It can be done, just because they're 18 doesn't make them incapable of learning a complex defensive scheme.

No, but apparently being 70 makes a coach incapable of teaching it.

The only reasonable explanation for our shitty defense in the past several years is coaching. We get elite athletes, elite players. We don't teach them how to defend.
 
We get elite skill players, I wouldn't necessarily say we get elite athletes. At least not the way UK or KU do. I've said it before, so I'll say it here. A starting back court of Grayson Allen and Kennard is/was never going to be good defensively. I think the way we are recruiting is having more impact on defense than the actual teaching of defense.
 
We get elite skill players, I wouldn't necessarily say we get elite athletes. At least not the way UK or KU do. I've said it before, so I'll say it here. A starting back court of Grayson Allen and Kennard is/was never going to be good defensively. I think the way we are recruiting is having more impact on defense than the actual teaching of defense.

Agree with this.
 
We get elite skill players, I wouldn't necessarily say we get elite athletes. At least not the way UK or KU do. I've said it before, so I'll say it here. A starting back court of Grayson Allen and Kennard is/was never going to be good defensively. I think the way we are recruiting is having more impact on defense than the actual teaching of defense.

I disagree with this. Which backcourt do you think is more athletic? Duhon-Ewing-Redick or Jackson-Allen-Kennard? Kennard, while not an elite athlete is not a bad one by any means. Allen is a terrific athlete, and if he weren't white, his athleticism wouldn't be questioned. Point is, Duke wasn't doomed with those two being in the lineup. If Duhon-Redick and Ewing can play good defense at their athleticism, there isn't any reason for the current Duke players to not be able to. The you need athletes to play good defense crowd is so dated. There are so many teams with lesser athletes than Duke that play much better defense. That is coaching. Either spend more time on it and teach it more effectively or change your system to better utilize your talent and youth.

If Bagley,Carter and Bolden can protect the rim, then I think Duke will be passable on the defensive end of the floor this season. In my opinion, the biggest issue in terms of the defense the last few years has been the lack of a good defensive center, which is even more important when Duke goes small at the 4. I am a huge advocate of playing smaller at the 4 spot, but you really need a defensive anchor at the 5 to be able to get away with it or have Justise Winslow destroy other teams offenses. Amile and Jabari to Marshall and again with Amile there was just nothing to deter the other team from scoring at will around the rim. Their defensive rebounding has also been in the bottom half nationally the last few years which is pretty bad, considering, 50% of Division 1 is starting a 6'7'' or 6'8'' center and those teams have nowhere near the athletes Duke has.
 
Yeah, if Frank Jackson and Grayson Allen aren't athletic then I don't know what athletic is. And neither do NBA scouts, apparently, since that's a word they use often to describe both players.
 
I'm glad he's on this team. This is my final straw with a Coach K coached defense. If he can't produce a good one with the pieces in place to have a good defensive team, then we probably won't ever have one again with him coaching.
If you want a great defensive team then you may as well get off the OAD bandwagon. Teaching 18 year olds how to playdefense is difficult especially when they have one foot out the door. Kids are either going to already be great at defense or they aren't going to be at Duke most likely.

That's an excuse. Not only have we seen Kentucky produce multiple very good to elite defenses with young teams, but Duke and Coach K showed, although only for 6 games in 2015, that it is possible. Our 2015 NCAA tournament defense was elite elite elite. It can be done, just because they're 18 doesn't make them incapable of learning a complex defensive scheme.

No, but apparently being 70 makes a coach incapable of teaching it.

The only reasonable explanation for our shitty defense in the past several years is coaching. We get elite athletes, elite players. We don't teach them how to defend.

The OAD kids don't play defense. They're here to show off their skill set to the people watching. That's 90% what they care about. Being the best defender in the floor doesn't get them drafted in the lottery. Being able to drive both ways, hit open shots and jump out of the gym do.
No coach no matter what age can get 5 mostly 18 year old guys to play high quality defense in 1 month. Not happening.
Now I think this team can play solid defense if the staff makes it easy like the 2010 type of defense. Pack it in, funnel the ball handler to the rim protectors. That's a defense young guys can win with.

And to respond to slap the floor... I don't watch Kentucky play but I'd bet th players coming in are already very solid M2M defenders before coming to Lex and Cal doesn't over play or plays a simpler defense focusing on his OADs strengths.
 
The OAD kids don't play defense. They're here to show off their skill set to the people watching. That's 90% what they care about. Being the best defender in the floor doesn't get them drafted in the lottery. Being able to drive both ways, hit open shots and jump out of the gym do.
No coach no matter what age can get 5 mostly 18 year old guys to play high quality defense in 1 month. Not happening.
Now I think this team can play solid defense if the staff makes it easy like the 2010 type of defense. Pack it in, funnel the ball handler to the rim protectors. That's a defense young guys can win with.

And to respond to slap the floor... I don't watch Kentucky play but I'd bet th players coming in are already very solid M2M defenders before coming to Lex and Cal doesn't over play or plays a simpler defense focusing on his OADs strengths.


You totally contradicted yourself in this post. You say that OAD kids don't play defense and then admit that they do at Kentucky. Regardless of the reason why, it is definitely possibly to play good defense with OAD players. Is it harder, sure, but it can be done, Kentucky has proven it over and over again. The excuse of Kentucky gets guys that are already good on defense is so weak. Callipari and K go head to head on almost every recruit. It's not like Callipari had no interest and didn't try to get Jabari Parker or Jahlil Okafor. Or K had no interest in Julius Randle or Karl Towns. It's up to the coaching staff to do a better job with the defense, I.E. change the strategy and or put more of a focus on it in practice.
 
I am in complete agreement with @wtbball21 on this one. It's scheme or staff. There is almost zero chance Duke just happens to recruit all the NAD's, OAD's or TAD's that refuse to play defense. In fact, I thought Tatum gave a ton of effort on the defensive end, but broken legged Amile was anchoring the back line.. Or broken legged Harry. Or broken spirited Bolden.
 
I thought Amile's defense was terrific even on one leg. He was just a 6'9" dude playing center in a system that causes guards to get burned on the perimeter, demanding constant rim protection in compensation.
 
The athletes = defense thing is ridiculous. I don't even know how we're having this conversation on the board of a program where our best defenders in the past 17 years have been mainly below-average athletes (on the scale of Power 5 basketball programs): Shane Battier. Shelden Williams. Brian Zoubek. Duhon. LT and Kyle were pretty good. The only guys that stand out on defense for us who were elite athletes were probably Winslow and Nelson.

I do think that if you took STF's post and switched "skill" for "being good at offense" and "athleticism" for "being good at defense", it's probably true of our recruiting for most of this decade. It explains why we've finished in the top 10 on offense for 9 straight years.
 
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As has been well covered on here, part of both Carter's and Trent's calling card as prospects is specifically that they both understand how to play defense and actually put in effort on that end to do it. That should bode well for this team relative to our other recent ones.
 
I think the problem is multi-part:

1) I think Coach K's style of overplay defense is somewhat outdated. It comes from an era when it was easier to force turnovers and much more handchecking was allowed on the perimeter.

2) This system requires a lot of communication. This makes it particularly hard for freshman to run effectively.

3) The new OAD era puts a lot of freshmen together on a single team.

4) The staff hasn't compensated by adjusting to a more conservative style of defense or recruiting prospects with their defensive abilities in mind.
 
Yeah, if Frank Jackson and Grayson Allen aren't athletic then I don't know what athletic is. And neither do NBA scouts, apparently, since that's a word they use often to describe both players.

Allen is an overrated athlete. He's a good athlete don't get me wrong, white kids that can jump are always viewed as athletic freaks. He has a great first step and obviously jumps well, and i think he has good explosion off of his jump. He has horrible body control in the air, which is partly impacted because he plays with zero pace, and this overall negatively impacts his ability to finish around the rim against bigger players.

I personally view offensive athleticism and defensive athleticism as two separate things. Defensively Allen has long arms which is nice, but he's really slow laterally, especially after his initial first two steps, he lags. He is consistently beat off of the dribble. To be fair, Allen plays very hard defensively.

If you want to look at elite athletes defensively look no further than Louisville. They are the standard at least to me in recruiting elite level athletes on defense. I actually think Duke and UL are polar opposites in that regard. Duke IMO has always been the model for recruiting offensive talent and skill. Pitino recruits guys who can't shoot for shit and have low offensive IQ's but goodness he recruits savages to unleash defensively. Jim Calhoun used to be like this. Maybe not to the extent Pitino currently is doing (he's increased it in recent years) but similar philosophies recruiting wise.
 

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