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NBA

Man, I haven't watched much NBA in the past few years, but these playoffs are fucking fun. Cool to have so many actually decent Duke players involved.

Bucks feel like they're up there with the sixers in terms of promising futures to me.

Giannis looks like he'll be LeBron for the next decade
Middleton is a aesthetically gross, but seems like big-time third-option on a contender caliber.
Maker looks like he'll end up being that big-time shotblocker and floor stretcher
Brogden is fine as a low-maintenance, 2-way SG.

They really just need to upgrade Bledsoe to a shooting PG who's comfortable playing off the ball, and that's a great vote. They'd be a perfect fit for Trae Young.

Sadly, Jabari makes no sense on that team. Sucks they didn't extend him, because he plus Bledsoe could probably get them a nice PG.
 
Also, what is Boston going to do? Tatum and Brown have been really fun to watch together this series, and seem like perfect 2/3 options to pair with Kyrie going forward. Rozier and Ojeleye look like they'll be legit assets for a contender moving forward as well. Baynes is a great depth guy, but not the long-term solution at C.

Seems like trading Hayward has to happen, if they can get away with it. He doesn't fit unless you push Tatum to the 4 full-time, and there's sense in making things complicated with your young core. They really do just need Wendell Carter in two years - a rebounding rim protector who's also a threat from three.
 
A few things:

Jabari has actually been playing really well in recent games. I don't necessarily think he doesn't fit, especially if his three-point shooting comes back to where it was before. Also, I see Brogdon as more of a backup PG than a SG. I agree about Bledsoe though.

I still don't see them as quite as promising as the Sixers. The Sixers have already done a better job surrounding Simmons with shooters. They have a better coach. And they have defense at the most important position on the floor (assuming Embiid can stay healthy). Also, Giannis may be the better scorer and all-around player at the moment, but I think Simmons is better at running a team due to his superior passing.

As for the Celtics, I don't hate Tatum at the 4. He played it a good amount this year. Unfortunately, the Lakers (likely) did a little too well for the Celtics to get their pick and draft Carter. He'll end up somewhere awful.
 
Where do you see Jabari fitting on the Bucks? Giannis and Middleton are their best two players, and play the same position. Hard for me to see Jabari ever having a role as a starter on the Bucks - plus, another attacking 6'9 guy who isn't a great shooter just seems redundant on a Giannis team. Seems like he'd be much more valuable elsewhere.

I don't hate Tatum at the 4 either, but wouldn't want it to be full time, which is pretty much how it would have to go with both Brown and Hayward. He and Brown are pretty much a perfect young duo, so it seems counterproductive to mess with that to try to insert a guy who hasn't even played yet, if you can instead trade him for similar, but more complementary, value.
 
I think the Celtics should stand pat for the moment. They have almost all of the ingredients for a juggernaut in today's NBA. Running out KI/Brown/Hayward/Tatum/Baynes maybe with a bench of Rozier/Smart/Ojeleye/Theis or Morris/Alford? Those are some pretty balanced 2-way lineups. Probably need Tatum or Brown to step up into a true offensive star to get over the top, but I'd be hesitant to blow it up for anyone but maybe Klay Thompson or Anthony Davis (of people who theoretically might be available).

From the mocks, I'd assume the Celtics would be in a great position to get Spellman if he stays in or Wagner. I think you roll the dice trying to get a stretch 5 these days.
 
Celtics need to keep picking their spots in consolidating assets for superstars. They did well to be patient for someone at Kyrie's level to become available, and now Kawhi will be available. They and the Rockets have fundamentally similar approaches; the Rockets are one superstar ahead in the race but with a shorter window now, and the Celtics haven't lucked into a center as ridiculously valuable as Capela yet.

With Brown's emergence, the Celtics can probably get Kawhi for only one of Brown or Tatum, combined with a decent 1st rounder and a big matching contract that's not negative value (Hayward or Horford). If the Celtics can also turn Horford and some random stuff into Cousins via a Pelicans sign-and-trade, and if Cousins would be willing to only take 2-3 years from the Celtics, I would consider that, too. Max at 4 years for Cousins is too much for the Celtics to gamble on. Davis would probably like the idea of playing with Horford.

KI
Gary
KL
Jay
Cous
 
Pantone287 said:
Where do you see Jabari fitting on the Bucks? Giannis and Middleton are their best two players, and play the same position. Hard for me to see Jabari ever having a role as a starter on the Bucks - plus, another attacking 6'9 guy who isn't a great shooter just seems redundant on a Giannis team. Seems like he'd be much more valuable elsewhere.

I don't hate Tatum at the 4 either, but wouldn't want it to be full time, which is pretty much how it would have to go with both Brown and Hayward. He and Brown are pretty much a perfect young duo, so it seems counterproductive to mess with that to try to insert a guy who hasn't even played yet, if you can instead trade him for similar, but more complementary, value.
Click to expand...
I don't buy that they play the same position. Middleton is a SF/SG. Giannis is a point forward who can play any position. Jabari is ideal as a stretch 4. In 2017, he shot 37% from three on 3.5 attempts a game.

The main issue I see with him on the Bucks is defense. If they want to continue their commitment to a swarming style, that is where he really struggles to fit in. However, I don't see the issue offensively with a 20 ppg who can stretch the floor decently and has the size and strength to rebound with opposing bigs.
 
Fair points. The entire sum of my opinions come from watching one game over the past three years and no research.

I still think that, from an ideal mismatch/spacing/defense standpoint, slotting Giannis in at the "4" between Middleton and a big makes the most sense, and given that Middleton has a similar reach to a Tatum and has shot > 40% from three during most of his career. Having a 3-5 frontcourt like that gives you a lot of flexibility in terms of your backcourt - you really just need shooters, and you don't need to pay for big ones, ones who are LeBron-stopper defenders, etc.

I suppose you could slot Jabari in at the equivalent of the 2, but you really just want a 3 & D guard there, IMO, not a max contract 6'9 guy who may or may not get his 3PT% back up to the high 30s.

I do think Jabari makes a ton more sense in a lineup where Giannis is the biggest guy on the court for the bucks, but I don't think you want to have Giannis battling centers all season in your primary lineup, and Jabari is too talented/costly to keep him as a death lineup reserve.
 
I guess a more concise phrasing of that is, if 4/5 of your main lineup is

[a C]
Giannis
Middleton
[a PG]

...is Jabari a better/more valuable fit than, say, Wayne Ellington as the fifth player?
 
I guess it all comes down to what you see the league becoming in 3-5 years. Five years ago traditional lineups were still the norm/ideal, and people still thought guys like Okafor were worthy of a top-3 pick. I think by 2023, guys like Giannis, Simmons, Griffin, etc. are going to be the de facto '5s' for the teams that are really contenders. Either that or some uber-athletic freak like Capela or maybe Bagley if he can learn to play defense. Guys like Cousins, Porzingis and even KAT may see their value dwindle as they increasingly become defensive liabilities.

Hell, I think you could see LeBron become a lineup of death type 'center' somewhere and have another 5-6 fantastic years as a rich man's Draymond. No traditional big guy would come close to having a big enough post-game/rebounding edge to compensate for being made totally useless on the defensive end.
 
Giannis can really guard 1-4. They probably let Parker walk but I absolutely could see him working with their roster. If they did keep him then I'd move Bledsoe. He's not much of a shooter and neither is Giannis. But you could use Giannis the point forward who guards the opposing 3 or 4. Parker at the 3 who guards the opposing 3 or 4. Middleton as the SG.

Bledsoe
Middleton
Parker
Giannis
Maker


Rozier would be perfect for them as he wouldn't cost a ton. Can play good D, create for himself and others as well as being a solid outside shooter.
 
Cmon, you addressed no previous points being made by anyone and just vomited out a completely unnuanced opinion along with a list of names everyone already knows with no new context or perspective. That is a valueless post and a waste of everyone's time who reads it. Why?
 
The Jazz blew a 20+ point lead? Glad I turned it off. If I had to pick two teams I hate as much as Golden State, it would the Thunder and the Raptors. I love Steven Adams, but Westbrook is my least favorite superstar to watch since prime Dwight Howard.
 
rome8180 said:
The Jazz blew a 20+ point lead? Glad I turned it off. If I had to pick two teams I hate as much as Golden State, it would the Thunder and the Raptors. I love Steven Adams, but Westbrook is my least favorite superstar to watch since prime Dwight Howard.
Click to expand...
I thought I may have dreamed of Utah's 25 point lead when I heard the final score on the radio this morning.
 
Pantone287 said:
Cmon, you addressed no previous points being made by anyone and just vomited out a completely unnuanced opinion along with a list of names everyone already knows with no new context or perspective. That is a valueless post and a waste of everyone's time who reads it. Why?
Click to expand...

Very kind of you Pantone. Like 4 posts above you stated you didn't see a spot for Parker. Rome disagree with you and posted that Middleton, Parker and Giannis are interchangeable with Parker being perfect for a stretch 4. I stated that I liked seeing Parker at the 3, especially as he gains back some of his athleticism and I'd prefer Giannis as the 4 because of his insane length.
 
My 2 cents re: Jabari: I think Jabari can work for the Bucks for the reason @rome8180 pointed out - solid stretch 4. He just needs 1 full season of health and I think you will see the Bucks take another step forward with him in that position. They just need some shooters to fill out that lineup (fuck Bledsoe).

Re: Celtics

Firstly, I fucking love this team. So much adversity this year, and they are a game away from wining a series.

Going forward, I would prefer if they stay the course as mentioned by @deeyoukayeee . The pieces are there, just some minor tweaks are required. Baynes is a really underrated centre - never does anything stupid, sets great screens, decent defensive position. I would like to see a rim-protector with the ability to run the floor for the 2nd unit. Shooting will improve with KI and GH back next fall.

Rozier has become a must sign, IMO (I think his contract is expiring next year). He has improved every year and is a decent on-ball defender. Kind of like Avery Bradley was a couple years back.

It would appear that they will move on from Marcus Smart based on his expected contract demands. They will have to put $ towards retaining Brown & Rozier, which makes good sense to me. Smart's shot selection and shooting ability hurt the team, as this board has emphasized (I agree with this take). However, I will defend his other contributions by saying that his playmaking is an asset (Zack Lowe has previously written about this) and he is their best defender other than Horford. In this series, Middleton is going to 'get his'; Smart makes him work the hardest. I also think he comes up with timely defensive plays.

ETA: Larkin probably should not be back. Shaky decision making that is not made up for in other areas of his game.

Go Celts
 
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Toronto, why would you post that twice and waste every posters time?


Seriously though, I agree and I love Rozier but I fear he may get more than the Cs can offer. Looking back, I really wish they hadn't signed Hayward. Would love to see them package Hayward or Horford, a young guy not named Brown or Tatum and a pick or two for a better all star.
 
Rozier is fools gold. Role player who tricks people into thinking he's better than he is with a few flashes of good shooting games when he's anything but consistent and still can't run an offense to save his life. He's exactly the type of player you don't offer anything more than MLE for if you have several potential max contracts to sign soon.

I don't like Smart nearly as much as most C's fans but at lesst he can create for others and defend every night, even if he still shoots way too goddamn much. He needs to be the backup guard if you can ink him for something like 4/40 or 3/36.
 


PG Ben Simmons
SG Kawhi Leonard
SF LeBron James
PF Kevin Knox (assuming Wendell Carter is picked earlier, probably by the Sacramento Kings)
C Joel Embiid
 
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